Facebook - what are your thoughts?

[KillCrazy]

So I have been using Facebook for quite a long time now and I have praised it on being a great platform for my friends and I to keep in touch, share our pictures, share events and chat together. However, something that occurred today has me changing my mind completely.

Those of you who use Facebook will know about your news feed that shows updates of what your friends are up to, whether they add photographs, update their status or add someone as a friend. What also shows up on your news feed by default is any post, video or photograph that just one of your friends may comment or like. For example, if one of my friends were to comment on a photograph of a TV show, that photograph will show up on my news feed with the title "A friend commented on a post..." or something to that effect. What happened today was very disturbing. A video showed up on my feed of which one of my friends made a comment on. This video was titled something along the lines of "Very shocking video - MUST SEE!!!". When I clicked to view the video and skim through it, I was subjected to watching a group of people being beaten, punched, thrown around and set on fire.
Now I know the internet has its dark side and people can find content like this if they really wished to, but to have it show up on my Facebook page got me rather furious. Also, probably everyone I know (who is also friends with the person who comment), may have that video on their news feed and may probably be subjected to it as well. This has me very worried.

Now of course, I could hide the video, change my settings on Facebook and do other such things to stop that from happening again, but I didn't want to leave it at that. I made steps to report the video to Facebook and hopefully have it removed so other people don't witness it. I could have thrown blame to my friend who commented on it but as she said to me her comment expressed her own distress and disgust to the video, and the fact that it showed up on my feed was a consequence of Facebook's default operation.
It doesn't end there. Much to my surprise I received a message from Facebook very soon after I reported the video. Here is what it said:

"Thanks for your report. We reviewed the video you reported, but found it doesn't violate Facebook's Community Standard on graphic violence, which includes depicting harm to someone or something, threats to the public's safety, or theft and vandalism."

I don't know what the hell is going on, but if Facebook have a feature to report a video of having extreme content, their system must bloody well work. This in itself is shocking and I am very disappointed with Facebook as a whole. This is also not the only incident of something like this happening. I have come across three such videos in the past that have made their way onto my news feed. After receiving that I opted in to provide feedback on their decision and wrote them some very stern words.

Phew, I apologise for the large post but I feel very strongly on this. How does everyone else feel about Facebook and what are your thoughts on this incident? I am debating whether or not to delete my Facebook account and not use it again but I like being able to keep in touch with my friends.

 

[Nanor]

Initially I believe Facebook weren't going to remove the videos taking the stance "that's life" but after serious complaints I believe they've u-turned. Still pretty amazed they'd take that initial stance, though.

 

[KillCrazy]

Thanks for the link Nanor, I didn't know about this. Curious to see that someone who contacted the BBC had pretty much the same experience and response from Facebook as me.

Looks like they are still taking a stance though seeing as I got a reply pretty much stating there is nothing wrong with the video so we are doing nothing. I can agree to an extent that people can have a certain freedom to depict the world as it is, but I don't think Facebook is an appropriate place to do so. Imagine younger users of Facebook such as members of your family, enjoying a chat to their friends or sharing funny pictures, to then see a curious video appear on their news feed which subjects them to disturbing violence. I'm not happy about it at all and I think it's wrong. Let people willingly seek shit like that out on another website if they so desire it, don't let it show up on Facebook for god's sake.

 

[Nanor]

I imagine their U-turn will take a bit of time. Send them a complaint, maybe?

 

[KillCrazy]

I imagine their U-turn will take a bit of time. Send them a complaint, maybe?

Well when they got back to me about the video I reported there was an option to give feedback so I wrote a little complaint there.

 

[Ki!ler-Mk1]

TL;DR

I agree with you, but don't think it is up to us to dictate what is on FB(no one forces us to go there*); The internet yes, but one website, no.
*Business models built on social exclusion and peer pressure really suck, but what can ya do.

Looks like they are still taking a stance though seeing as I got a reply pretty much stating there is nothing wrong with the video so we are doing nothing. I can agree to an extent that people can have a certain freedom to depict the world as it is, but I don't think Facebook is an appropriate place to do so.

I completely agree with you from the standpoint of a user, in fact I have used the "report" function unsuccessfully on fb 3 times for content I found offensive(always sexual).

Conversely, "I don't think..." - its your opinion, but do you not think you are transferring your ideal onto a company who's business is not yours?

What I mean is, not to criticise you but rather to draw attention to the fact that FB has become such an invasive part of the lives of those who use it that they think it should be subject to the same expectations they have of the pre FB world, the real world?

This is the internet not real life, many companies still take this view, and they are in a manner of speaking correct, as it is a company. The best analogy I can think of is that of, exhibitions and public libraries, if such content was visible for anyone to see there would be local out cry, and things would be done about it. In real life.

So, I agree absolutely with regards that anyone could see, but who are you(we) to dictate what content is on FB, if you don't like it go elsewhere. EDIT: (Rhetoric... You have no choice due to the business model I outlined above.)

Incidentally and unrelated while I do not watch videos likely to shock, someone did link me once an ogrish (Do not visit the site)vid and i was very very not impressed, however i was not disturbed in the slightest, and I wondered, are people shocked/disturbed, distressed, react as expected/vomit etc because they have learned from television that this is how they are expected to react to real life.


Feel free to bring up FB's alleged duty of care to all its users, if they have one

 

[Ronin Storm]

Feel free to bring up FB's alleged duty of care to all its users, if they have one

I don't think it's an allegedly duty of care, I think it actually exists. But it does go both ways: they can't do too much censorship before they're actually getting in the way, but cleaning out some of the crap is pretty much a requirement of any public forum (we have to do it here, from time to time). Personally, I don't use FB and never have. I have an account that I acquired for authentication purposes and it's useful for that, but I just don't see the point otherwise... still, if I were to use it then I'd expect that it'd be relatively clean (much like this place) and hopefully responsive to reports of abusive content. That said, I suspect that those handling these reports are really hampered by the depths of the stuff they have to review because some of that stuff will be vile and it's got to knock their keel off...

 

[Panda with issues...]

I don't really know what's going on with facebook nowadays.

It's changed so much recently I can barely use it.

Generally my opinion would be that since the content on your fed is derived from your friends, if you get a bunch of bad shit, it's either their, or your fault. Most of my news fed is filled with pictures of horses and rabbits from some of my friends, and boat and science information, due to that being the stuff that interests them.

 

[KillCrazy]

I agree with you, but don't think it is up to us to dictate what is on FB(no one forces us to go there*); The internet yes, but one website, no.

Conversely, "I don't think..." - its your opinion, but do you not think you are transferring your ideal onto a company who's business is not yours?


So, I agree absolutely with regards that anyone could see, but who are you(we) to dictate what content is on FB, if you don't like it go elsewhere.

I just think some level of care needs to be given toward Facebook's users. I know it's not our business to dictate what they do but most businesses that cater to other people want to ensure that they are keeping their customers/users happy and that involves listening to their opinion on matters such as this. If they want to keep content like that on their site then at bare minimum they should stamp some warnings next to a video so that people are made aware before clicking on them. I'm mainly thinking about the younger and more naive users of Facebook who could be harmed by this. Again you could see me as dictating what they should do but we have restrictions on these things in society, for example age certifications on movies and games where the violence depicted there is faked. Like Ronin says you expect it to be relatively clean. I've even seen myself remove people from my friends list who they themselves created abusive or disgusting content or comments - I simply don't want to be associated with them. I couldn't go elsewhere either if I don't like it. Most people I know, if not everyone, use Facebook to stay in touch. There is no where else to go until the next big craze or successor to Facebook comes along.

Incidentally and unrelated while I do not watch videos likely to shock, someone did link me once an ogrish (Do not visit the site)vid and i was very very not impressed, however i was not disturbed in the slightest, and I wondered, are people shocked/disturbed, distressed, react as expected/vomit etc because they have learned from television that this is how they are expected to react to real life.

I guess everyone is different in how sensitive they are to this stuff. Personally when I see stuff of an ogrish calibur I do feel rather distressed. I get a sickening feeling, lose my appetite and even sometimes feel slightly dizzy. Call me a wuss but that's what happens! I don't think its because TV has told me to react that way. I would say that having a distressed reaction to that sort of stuff is natural as you are witnessing something that makes you aware of your own mortality or the prospect that as a living being you could be suffering in a similar way or suffering the same fate. I think it's a good reaction to have. If people are sickened and distressed by violence or gore then they would not try to replicate it or bring harm to other human beings. They would even want to see such things be stopped. Anyway, this is a whole other topic for discussion!

 

[Panda with issues...]

What are ogrish videos, or do I not want to know?

 

[KillCrazy]

I don't really know what's going on with facebook nowadays.

It's changed so much recently I can barely use it.

Generally my opinion would be that since the content on your fed is derived from your friends, if you get a bunch of bad shit, it's either their, or your fault. Most of my news fed is filled with pictures of horses and rabbits from some of my friends, and boat and science information, due to that being the stuff that interests them.

Aye, I agree with you there. The problem though, is that it only takes one of your friends to go and comment on something for it to show up on your feed. My friend made a strongly worded comment against the video as she was herself disgusted by it. However, probably unbeknownst to her was that upon commenting on the video, she inadvertently shared the video to everyone on her list of friends. This is the default action of Facebook, and you would need to fiddle through a few settings to turn it off.

 

[KillCrazy]

What are ogrish videos, or do I not want to know?

It used to be the name of a website that specialised in hosting a lot of graphic content of blood, gore and violence. I think it was user based as well so anyone could share what they had.

 

[Panda with issues...]

Aye, I agree with you there. The problem though, is that it only takes one of your friends to go and comment on something for it to show up on your feed. My friend made a strongly worded comment against the video as she was herself disgusted by it. However, probably unbeknownst to her was that upon commenting on the video, she inadvertently shared the video to everyone on her list of friends. This is the default action of Facebook, and you would need to fiddle through a few settings to turn it off.

I understand your position, don't get me wrong. Surely the video wasn't on autoplay though?

It used to be the name of a website that specialised in hosting a lot of graphic content of blood, gore and violence. I think it was user based as well so anyone could share what they had.

Yeah, there's another one to avoid.

 

[KillCrazy]

I understand your position, don't get me wrong. Surely the video wasn't on autoplay though?

Yeah that's true. People don't need to click on these videos and watch them. I had no idea, however, what was going on in the video until I clicked play. The video was simply entitled 'shocking! A must watch video!!', so I was naturally curious. I didn't expect to see what I did, although from now on I'm going to be extra vigilant. It's why I am thinking that if Facebook choose to keep these videos on their site that they should at least stamp a warning on to them.

 

[Panda with issues...]

Yeah that's true. People don't need to click on these videos and watch them. I had no idea, however, what was going on in the video until I clicked play. The video was simply entitled 'shocking! A must watch video!!', so I was naturally curious. I didn't expect to see what I did, although from now on I'm going to be extra vigilant. It's why I am thinking that if Facebook choose to keep these videos on their site that they should at least stamp a warning on to them.

Fair play.

I never click on anything that has ambivalent titles like that.

To get me to click, you need a direct, applicable informative title like 'Penis Enhancement pills, work in 2 weeks guaranteed, $20'

 

[Traxata]

I don't really know what's going on with facebook nowadays.

It's changed so much recently I can barely use it.

Generally my opinion would be that since the content on your fed is derived from your friends, if you get a bunch of bad shit, it's either their, or your fault. Most of my news fed is filled with pictures of horses and rabbits from some of my friends, and boat and science information, due to that being the stuff that interests them.

You forgot the cats.

 

[Ki!ler-Mk1]

I've had a look around the settings and I do not see a way to prevent things i've liked or commented on being shared against my will.


EDIT: BBC May 10th

From 1 interview.

Protecting children on the net is a responsibility of their parents in the first place. It cannot be outsourced to Facebook.

And from a different interview.

This is new territory for us all as we navigate the rules, ethics and standards of user-generated content sites.

And another perspective.

People, whether young or old, can be negatively affected by witnessing violence either on screen or in reality...

...Social networks' news feeds allow material to arrive on people's pages that might never be sought by choice.

Certainly agree with that, one of the commenters mentioned that FB should be able to tell which of its users are not adults and affect some kind of quarantine.


Any chance of adding "Censorship" to the thread title?

 

[Haven]

It sounds from your post KillCrazy that there is a set of guidelines but that they are not necessarily following them to the letter. Your description of the violence seems to match your quote of:

"Thanks for your report. We reviewed the video you reported, but found it doesn't violate Facebook's Community Standard on graphic violence, which includes depicting harm to someone or something, threats to the public's safety, or theft and vandalism."

In this case either the guidelines are not what they seem or they are not enforcing them.

Your post made me think of censorship in a broader sense so I've gone slightly off track with some rambling flame bait below
The danger of censorship based on an individual's sense of offence or belief is that there is so much variance in what causes offence that very soon everything causes offence to someone, at that point you have the complex issue of how much offence is too much.

I'm a strong believer in free speech as well as the power of "turning it off if you don't like it".

I think we've collectively learned that the power of outrage or offence is a way to manipulate what can and cannot be seen on-line and that projecting a sense of outrage/offence (legitimately or otherwise) is a way to make things the way we want. Therefore censoring based on individual user feedback is in my opinion unreliable and a bad idea. Collective feedback however may add weight to an argument and perhaps its just not enough collective weight was put into complaining about the video to cause them to act.

But then collective weight can also be applied by various online groups to censor content so is this really enough as well... The best bet is to have a damn well defined set of guidelines that you stick too otherwise you end up in a giant tug of opinion.

Yours
The nasty troll hiding under the forums

 

[Haven]

I think KillCrazy has been lobbying the BBC, either that or this is very convenient timing:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22464290

 

[Panda with issues...]

I'm a strong believer in free speech as well as the power of "turning it off if you don't like it".

In my opinion, this is a clear case of where self-censorship should be exercised, rather than relying on someone else to do that for you.