American "Policeman" gets Probation after sickening Assault.

T-Bone

In Cryo Sleep
So, I was linked to this video this morning. I gotta say I've heard and seen American cops do some sickening things, like tasing old people and nearly killing a pastor after he refused to be searched going over state borders without a warrant (I'll try and find some of the links to that as well) but this is horrible.

This is quite blatantly a case of a giant, drunk man destorying a tiny woman because she wouldn't serve him more booze. This just shows that there is absolutely no justice in America. Land of freedom...
 

Macca

Member
Yeah, it's a pretty sickening event. However I think it's a bit of a leap to say that there is absolutely no justice in America . I'm pretty sure you could find this kind of thing in almost every country. It's a sad fact of life that there are some people that get away with things they shouldn't.
 

Nanor

Well-Known Member
Yeah, it's quite a leap to say America has absolutely no justice.

It's sickening, no doubt but bear in mind the by stander who was knocked over by a riot policeman and suffered cardiac arrest at the G8 (?) talks.

America is no worse than anywhere else.
 

BiG D

Administrator
Staff member
Right, but everywhere else is terrible too, so that's not exactly a comfort.
 

Ronin Storm

Administrator
Staff member
As something of a tangent on this, I believe the US really have law enforcement where, say, the UK have policing. The focus is quite different. Law enforcement is about compliance. Policing is about community. One UK Army Major I spoke to commented that he felt this fundamental difference was a reason for different approaches in, say, Iraq between US and other peacekeeping forces.

Sure, I don't believe that either country is universally one or the other but the emphasis does seem to be about right. If so, requiring compliance may give a sense of power and this may lead to a peculiar world view, where I think community gives a sense of service, which is quite the opposite.
 

Taffy

New Member
As something of a tangent on this, I believe the US really have law enforcement where, say, the UK have policing. The focus is quite different. Law enforcement is about compliance. Policing is about community. One UK Army Major I spoke to commented that he felt this fundamental difference was a reason for different approaches in, say, Iraq between US and other peacekeeping forces.

Sure, I don't believe that either country is universally one or the other but the emphasis does seem to be about right. If so, requiring compliance may give a sense of power and this may lead to a peculiar world view, where I think community gives a sense of service, which is quite the opposite.

Very interesting thoughts. They seem sensible and make sense enough to me. In relation to the UK, I think that now the distinction has become a little blurred. Some elements of our police seem to want to be completely intouch with the community and be seen as a lovable force, whereas others want to focus entirely on enforcing the law tightly and strictly. More unified focus on one or the other would help I think.

Regarding the OP, I am disgusted by this guy. He is a police officer and is meant to act in a reasonable manner at all times. A police officer is always on duty, and so should act as such. He has disgraced not only himself but also the force on a wider scale, and muddied the police's name.
 

T-Bone

In Cryo Sleep
Yeah, I get what your saying their Ronin but I think now adays we are slowing growing into what America has, which is sad. I almost think the new police officers we are getting are being trained tot hink like this instead of the old style britich copper who would actually chase criminals and have a chat your average joe.

I must admit I have nothing but disdain for the police these days since I was nearly arrested for sitting on a wall eating chips...and then the time I was leaning on another wall making a phone call...and then the night I was sitting on a step waiting on a taxi...

However, it's like one of the guys from Work (Who's brother is one of them fuzz) says "Everyone hates the police until they need one." I'm not sure, I think I would be glad of them then but I don't think it would change the way I feel about them in general.
 

Nanor

Well-Known Member
I think saying that the British police force (whom I sincerely doubt you have a substantial amount of knowledge of what their direction or training is) is becoming like an American police force (which I am almost certain you have no idea what their direction or training is and seem to have based the knowledge you have from YouTube videos) is a very slippery slope to go down.
 

Ronin Storm

Administrator
Staff member
instead of the old style britich copper who would actually chase criminals and have a chat your average joe.

It varies by location, by individual police force. Which it probably should as different communities require different styles of policing because they contain different kinds of people.

In York, for example, police would stop and caution cyclists without lights, and serve notices on cyclists who ran red lights. Police were present as regular street patrols, usually in twos of one male and one female. Trouble in the city centre received an immediate response from one or two vans but always in line with the (usually drunken) disturbance. There was a real sense that the York police were present, interested and active and that their response was proportional.

In Eastleigh, I've seen a lesser on-street police cover. There's just less police on the streets, at least at times I've observed. Cyclists do crazy things with impunity. However, Eastleigh centre is quieter than York's on an evening, with the exception of outside McDonalds where it's common to see kids clustering and strutting (in the way groups of kids can do when left to themselves). It seems to me that there are less drunken people. So maybe the Eastleigh police are being proportional too, though less apparently present and interested.

Funding has a big part to play in what policing takes place. National policy also steers policing. For example, Labour focused on a crackdown on street crime by getting more police on the streets and other similar initiatives. Some senior police were reported to find this move to be ignoring some greater threats, but street crime was visible and also a sure vote winner so that was the priority.

I imagine that when a community grows, and especially when a community has access to firearms, different techniques are required to effectively and safely police them. I can't imagine that being faced with the threat of being shot does anything to help a police force feel comfortable with the guy on the street.

That said, one retired senior UK police man I spent some time talking with commented that the nature of the police force had changed over the years and while he hugely enjoyed his time in the force (on "the job") he was less sure about the way the force had developed. I don't get the impression that marred his experience but that he disagreed with some of the policies and direction that UK policing was employing. I can't tell whether that was as a product of being old and obstinate or whether there was a more fundamental philosophical difference (and now can't ask).
 

Gizmo-5

In Cryo Sleep
The law enforcement comment rings very true, America has developed a very black and white policy in regards to law, and their system seems to be very much based on revenge as apposed to rehabilitation (death sentences and life long imprisonments)

He said he was acting in self defence "she pushed me first" and in a black and white way he is right, she did push him first, and he "defended himself" however i like to think that a uk court would allow for more common sense, he was not defending himself from attack, he was neutralising a "potential threat", and when we look closer we see that the potential threat was very small indeed. Making his defence much weaker, and the prosecution stronger that, he got drunk and beat the shit out of someone much beyond rational need, and should be punished accordingly.

Id like to think here that kind of bully gets 5 years.
 

Gizmo-5

In Cryo Sleep
Out of curiosity, do you believe in revenge or rehabilitation?

depends what mood im in, and the individual circumstances of the crime, rehabilitation can include positive suffering, which can also cross over into the feelings of satisfaction that facilitate revenge.

If he admitted he'd unnecessarily beaten the woman from the start, instead of trying to justify it, i would have given him 3, with the possibility of early release on good behavior, also taking into account hes a police officer, and should know better.
 
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