Are landfills obsolete?

[SgtFury]

Found this through wis.dm (great name for a website)

http://www.popsci.com/popsci/science/873aae7bf86c0110vgnvcm1000004eecbccdrcrd.html

A plasma converter that sounds likes something out of Star trek.

 

[elDiablo]

That is the single most cool thing I have heard about in a very long time. I am very happy to wait 10 years for this to properly come into use, and another 5-10 years after that for it to become the norm. I'd even wait another 10 years after that for an eco-friendly politican to suggest digging up all the old crap we've buried and sending that through this machine too.

A little worries what all that matter is going (I mean, we only need so many tiles!), but otherwise - awesome.

Nice find, very interesting!

 

[Nanor]

That rocks! It'll not be long before we're on Mars and elD and I are taking on rocket launcher dudes with chain saws... Ah...

 

[BiG D]

The claim that it powers itself once you start it set off my bullshit alarm. :/

 

[thatbloke]

The claim that it powers itself once you start it set off my bullshit alarm. :/

surely this thing would generate a shedload of energy, and at least some of that could be put to good use?

 

[BiG D]

From wikipedia, emphasis mine:

However, perpetual motion usually refers to a device or system that delivers more energy than is put into it. Such a device or system would be in violation of the law of Conservation of Energy, which states that energy can never be created nor destroyed, and is therefore deemed impossible by mainstream physics.

 

[Ronin Storm]

Energy is being put in. In the form of waste; the system "burns" the waste, so to speak. So the initial electricity is more a catalyst than anything.

That's the way I read it.

 

[Wraith]

That's true Big D, but don't forget that the rubbish that is being broken down will also contain energy (in the form of chemical potential energy I believe - where energy is stored in the molecular bonds between atoms). As the reactions are likely to be exothermic reactions, releasing more heat energy or electrical energy than was put in is perfectly possible. There is no violation of the law of conservation of energy in this type of reaction as the energy introduced equals the energy output. It's just in a more useful form, having been transferred into first heat energy (from the reaction), followed by kinetic energy (steam drives the turbines) and finally into electrical energy to power the machine. In effect it works in exactly the same way as a coal fired power plant, the only difference being that it uses a different fuel.

It's not a perpetual motion machine as it will require a constant input of additional energy sources (ie waste) to maintain the reaction.

 

[Traxata]

It must work to some degree

 

[BiG D]

Of course... *wasn't thinking*

Still, maintaining a 30,000 degree temperature must use a shitload of energy. I still find it hard to believe it can operate like that, but who knows.

 

[elDiablo]

...maintaining a 30,000 degree temperature must use a shitload of energy. I still find it hard to believe it can operate like that, but who knows.

Ah... This talk is bringing back memories of A-Level chemistry and physics... The bonds between atoms contain a SHIT load of energy (sorry, that word is necessary!). Think about nuclear weapons. Ivy King (the largest pure fission nuclear bomb ever tested by the United States) had a 500kt yield with only 60Kg of highly enriched uranium.

Now, I understand that your general garden-variety household waste might be a wee bit less destructive than enriched uranium, but the fact still remains that the covalent bonds that are strong enough to hold atoms together against (for example) the Earth's gravity (yes, gravity is actually the weakest of all forces, but we can visibly see the effects here on Earth) , they have to be bloody strong. Strong forces mean lots of energy.

I wish I hadn't given up Chemistry and Physics They were fun!

 

[Haven]

Depends how much material you are heating to that temperature and for how long you need to sustain it. Also on how much energy you get back from that material through combustion/atomisation.

For example, targetted lasers can heat an incredibly small area to insane temperatures 100's of thousands of degree's for pico seconds with only a couple of watts power.

Still I've not read the initial link properly yet so I better go do that now