FPS Game Hopping ?!

HotStuff

Member
It suddenly just occurred to me that THN aren't playing regulary in any FPS leagues.

3 months ago we were playing BF2142 weekly and having success. This was dropped because "everyone is now playing TF2" apparently. OK fine, lets start playing TF2...right 3 league games later people don't turn up for clan match as "everyone is now playing COD4".

In last COD4 event the organiser didn't turn up as "everyone was playing sins of a solar empire".

Do you notice a pattern?

Are we leading the games or are the games leading us?
 

thatbloke

Junior Administrator
The problem as I see it is a lack of organisation. (and no that's not a dig at anyone in particular).

To enter the ED league we need a cod4 website... which was in the works but I haven't seen any progress on it for ages.

Soon as that gets up i think we will be playing.
 

Tetsuo_Shima

In Cryo Sleep
Yeah, I hear exactly what you're saying HotStuff but CoD4 is barely a couple of months old and is proving really popular, I'd give it a bit more of a chance yet before writing it off. I don't know about anyone else, but with or without THN, Ill be playing CoD4 in matches if I can.
 

Macca

Member
I personally still don't think that there is a game out yet, that has that WoW factor, the way that BF2 did or NS or that WoW has for people. I think untill you get a game like that, then trying to find people to organise/play regularly in leagues and such is damn near impossible.

I don't blame people for not organising these things. When your the one organising things and some people don't turn up or theres something wrong with the other persons server, your the first one to get confronted regardless of the fact you cannot control individuals actions. This has happened numerous times in the past with CSS or TF2 more recently.

This is why I feel you need a game that you know people want to play, and have got a certain dedication to. That way you don't need to worry about anything because you know people are going to turn up etc...
 

Tetsuo_Shima

In Cryo Sleep
I personally still don't think that there is a game out yet, that has that WoW factor, the way that BF2 did or NS or that WoW has for people.

I don't think the problem is the lack of games with zest, but how diversified THN has become. When it was NS, it was almost exclusively NS. When it was BF2, likewise. Right now we have people that are very interested in WoW, people that are very interested in Call of Duty 4 and another branch that loves TF2. Obviously the WoW partition has bloomed very well, but it's had a detrimental effect on the rest of the community as a whole because not everyone likes WoW (and how very vocal we are about it) but not everyone likes CoD4 or TF2 either, which means small fragments of people play games for a week or two and then move onto the next in their own individual ways and ultimately splinter themselves from the core.
It's a problem, because you can't force everyone to play a single game, but you can't sustain several very effectively. Another problem is that the WoW crowd, for some inexplicable reason, really aren't as vocal in the community as the bunch of folks that joined during the NS and BF2 days, so there isn't very much community building in that respect.
 

Ronin Storm

Administrator
Staff member
I don't think the problem is the lack of games with zest, but how diversified THN has become.

That's an interesting perspective and one I have fair sympathy for. Said in my own words, I feel we spend too much time trying to find the next cool game and too little time finding games with each other, remembering that playing together makes games cool.

Sure, you could caveat that to hell and back. The sentiment still stands, I feel.

Obviously the WoW partition has bloomed very well, but it's had a detrimental effect on the rest of the community as [...] for some inexplicable reason, [they] really aren't as vocal in the community as the bunch of folks that joined during the NS and BF2 days, so there isn't very much community building in that respect.

I'm of the belief that all major games that pull people into THN are beneficial to THN in the long run. No game lasts forever, and certainly not for all its players. MMORPGs have a longer play life than many FPS games so that turn around is likely to be substantially longer. My memory of BF2, however, is that a bunch of people joined and only played BF2, only replied to BF2 posts (and some then only in private clan forums). BF2 ended, a bunch left, but a whole bunch stayed because they liked us, we made them feel welcome.

not everyone likes WoW [...] but not everyone likes CoD4 or TF2 either, which means small fragments of people play games for a week or two and then move onto the next in their own individual ways and ultimately splinter themselves from the core.

Again, that comes back to what I said above. What might help, here, is a little community direction to help pull some threads together. Sure, there's always going to be a churn of games and a search for that really cool game that comes out every so often and that's often done in very small groups or individually (though, one might argue, it needn't be so ad-hoc). But let's not forget that we can make a decent game better by playing together. BF2 was somewhat extraordinary at the time but now that concept is well used, very standard stuff; we see refinements (and botches) of BF2 on a semi-regular basis. CoD4, as such, isn't a huge leap forward and is more in the vein of Counter Strike than Battlefield.

It's a problem, because you can't force everyone to play a single game

We wouldn't desire to attempt to "force" people to play certain games. It won't work for us and would be very much against who we are as a community. But we can provide direction and additional support to a short list of "core" games, a list that is slowly changing but not at the pace of once every four weeks.

but you can't sustain several very effectively.

Perhaps not, at our current active and available community size. As noted, WoW has a number of current THNers tied up for the time being. This might give us an impression that we have more people available than we really do. There are three responses to this, I think.

  • Wait 'til WoW runs its course. This could be 6-9-12 months; a long time. Not really worth considering, in my opinion.
  • Play games with smaller numbers. Focus on games that support 4 or 8 people at a time, remembering that team games that require 8 man teams need a 16 man practice squad...
  • Recruit.

This is a subset of thoughts I was alluding to earlier. Tetsuo called them out of me with his post. I'm reluctant to reveal more just now because I'm not quite ready; I'm preparing some ideas, letting them get some real wings, before releasing them. Too early, too new, not enough momentum, and they fall down before they've had chance to live. Little too much of that recently; plenty of enthusiasm, not sufficient momentum to overcome the inertia.
 
G

Gombol

Guest
It suddenly just occurred to me that THN aren't playing regulary in any FPS leagues.

3 months ago we were playing BF2142 weekly and having success. This was dropped because "everyone is now playing TF2" apparently. OK fine, lets start playing TF2...right 3 league games later people don't turn up for clan match as "everyone is now playing COD4".

In last COD4 event the organiser didn't turn up as "everyone was playing sins of a solar empire".

Do you notice a pattern?

Are we leading the games or are the games leading us?

i said this and everyone had a go at me...i was quite happly playing 2142 with THN...then TF2 came out..and everyone went to that...i never see any of THN on 2142 anymore...*Sigh*
 

Traxata

Junior Administrator
i said this and everyone had a go at me...i was quite happly playing 2142 with THN...then TF2 came out..and everyone went to that...i never see any of THN on 2142 anymore...*Sigh*

Gombol the reason for 2142 breaking down was because the game was well past its date, even if we were still playing it now, there are only a small number of other clans playing in one place (league wise) thats what causes a problem :)

I'm going to be putting a far greater effort into CoD than I have done in the last couple of weeks because when I started we were still well into the whole 'its x-mas/new year no ones around' I foudn a couple of other games that I was quite happy with spending hours and hours of time on them.

Obviously that was the case last week when I completely forgot about an event I'd created because I was in a really deep game with my fleet taking on Piacular's fleet, while Nanor, bambi and Docbot were having a go at each others border planets at the same time. Bob voiced this oppinion at me and I apologized, I will try damned hard to make sure this is not the case again :)

We need to join a CoD4 league, yes. I'm going to do some searching and stick a thread in the CoD dept so we all have a choice in which one to join (if not multiple). I'm doing that at the moment :)

/trax
 

Piacular

In Cryo Sleep
I'd say there will be one more hop HotStuff, in approximately 2 weeks 3 days, 7 hours 9 mins and 32 seconds. When Frontlines: Fuel of War is released. Built by the original BF2 bad boys, it's sure to be more complex than "Counter Strike with great bullet penetration", and just peachy! The problem with TF2 and CoD4 is that they just don't have the same team spirit. They're also a bit simple on the old manoeuvre front. BF2 and 2142 are way more shouty (the pure definition of teamspirit!), and hopefully so will Frontlines :)

I fully intend to throw all my enthusiasm into it without ever having played! So get ready to be roped into a war you never intended to fight!

Heh. :D
 

thatbloke

Junior Administrator
I'd say there will be one more hop HotStuff, in approximately 2 weeks 3 days, 7 hours 9 mins and 32 seconds. When Frontlines: Fuel of War is released. Built by the original BF2 bad boys, it's sure to be more complex than "Counter Strike with great bullet penetration", and just peachy! The problem with TF2 and CoD4 is that they just don't have the same team spirit. They're also a bit simple on the old manoeuvre front. BF2 and 2142 are way more shouty (the pure definition of teamspirit!), and hopefully so will Frontlines :)

I fully intend to throw all my enthusiasm into it without ever having played! So get ready to be roped into a war you never intended to fight!

Heh. :D

Is that the free one?
 

BiG D

Administrator
Staff member
I wonder if it's not just as simple as there being a lack of interest in organized competitive gaming at this point in time. Why is it so important that we have a competitive team? I see plenty of people playing games and enjoying themselves. Is that not what we're here for?
 

DeZmond

Junior Administrator
Agreed. I remember in the days of CS:S / NS (I never played BF2) we had loads of community gaming nights, and the servers were almost always populated, or you could congregate on a server somewhere else if required and play against other clans/ communities. I don't have CoD4, but this did happen for a short while with TF2, but after the first month or two that seems to have drastically died down, which is a real shame.
 

waterproofbob

Junior Administrator
I'd say there will be one more hop HotStuff, in approximately 2 weeks 3 days, 7 hours 9 mins and 32 seconds. When Frontlines: Fuel of War is released. Built by the original BF2 bad boys, it's sure to be more complex than "Counter Strike with great bullet penetration", and just peachy! The problem with TF2 and CoD4 is that they just don't have the same team spirit. They're also a bit simple on the old manoeuvre front. BF2 and 2142 are way more shouty (the pure definition of teamspirit!), and hopefully so will Frontlines :)

I fully intend to throw all my enthusiasm into it without ever having played! So get ready to be roped into a war you never intended to fight!

Heh. :D

I'm hoping frontlines is great but it looks like with all the little droid classes it'll have a whole load of very annoying features that'll make clan stuff either really restricted of just a bit meh. But I live in hope. i personally feel COD has a lot to offer and hope with the regular practices which are going to happen in the lead up to i33 that it'll go somewhere.
 
C

Colrob

Guest
I personally joined because of COD4 and the fact that my last clan were mainly americans and had no GMT match times. I've been in the other clan 2 years now and am a BF2 admin, yet still left their Cod4 division for here becuase of activity. If just a few people organise an event for a game and make sure everyones happy with that then it's enough to keep people interested in a particular game and no game hop.

I'm guessing that's what happened here with 2142 and Bf2? If people agree to play the game at certain organised event, like a ladder etc it would be great! Becuase people who cba to play that game will usually play it for the sake of hanging with the clan, and those that love the game are happy too.

I reckon that if someone is passionate about a game, and is bold enough to organise a small event for others, then it would be a success, but only if other people agreed. I know I'd join a small BF2 event even though I haven't played in ages... I'd even go as far as re-installing a game to play with you guys.


So to some up my babble :rolleyes: it's a clan that keeps games interesting, not particularly the game itself, and if everyone makes the effort to be active at an agreed event, then the game will last longer. For eg my last clan still play halo with around 500 active members, even though its old and IMO crap lol. I agree with the need for recruitment too :) My two cents worth.
 

Tetsuo_Shima

In Cryo Sleep
I'd say there will be one more hop HotStuff, in approximately 2 weeks 3 days, 7 hours 9 mins and 32 seconds. When Frontlines: Fuel of War is released. Built by the original BF2 bad boys, it's sure to be more complex than "Counter Strike with great bullet penetration", and just peachy!

I hope you realise that people say that about pretty much every single game on the radar. 'It looks soooo good' 'No, no, no, no, YES! This ones a BF2 beater!' 'It has automatic customiseable adaption suites for your cryogenic body armour!' and they all turn out the same way in a couple of weeks. I've given up buying all these games people claim will be world beaters, only to throw them on the shelf a couple of weeks later. Na, I think I'll stick with my CounterStrike with bullet penetration for the timebeing.
 

HotStuff

Member
I've given up buying all these games people claim will be world beaters, only to throw them on the shelf a couple of weeks later.

That is the point I am kinda making from the first post. We will never get good at any one game if we keep getting swung by the next one that is released. The reason why we got gubbed at TF2 clan games was because we got beat by people who stuck at it.

As said by...., (dammit can get a multiquote) it isn't just about the game but the community spirit in playing competitive clan matches. Tonight for example is a COD4 practice, I would rather play a CSS clan match if I had the choice, not because I like CSS better but because it's a clan match.

COD4 is a good "lowest common denominator" game in that it is easy to learn without much difficult to master 'fancy extras'. I am glad there are COD4 games being organised and hope for the moment we will stick at it and hell we might even win a clan match!? :rolleyes:

Until this 'Frontlines' game establishes itself and there is at least v1.1 patch I don't think we should be holding our breath. I will buy it if everyone else does and it looks like there is potential for us to be clan matching with it.
 
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