Tanking.. "the whys and where's"

Burrick

Member
Ok so most of you might of heard that i have re-specc'ed holy/tankadin (not sure why just a moment of madness maybe)

However... my gear is pretty ok now ...i have gems and enchants thanks to guildies and have a general idea on what rotation (have been tanking heroics) i need to use..but some pally tanking advice would be very welcome from a few different people as you all seem to play this class a bit different form each other....

Also advice like tanking bosses and adds? .. am i expected to tank bosses and all adds or is it all fight dependant?

All general bullshit like that really

Thanks in advance to all :)

P.s this nice burrick wont be lasting for long so please take full advantage.. :)
 

lawn

In Cryo Sleep
Be aggressive, pull all, dont stop and drag the rest of the group with you... not much else to it really.

A general tip for tanking though is to try and keep your situational awareness up. You never know when someone will randomly pull another pack, off tank dies suddenly, healers are getting mauled... so be on the ball and ready to save the day. You'd be surprised what you can live through as a pali tank with CD's up.

I've never been a fan of the stam stacking alot of tanks tend to do, I prefer to aim for a mixed balance of def/stam/strength. Think this is a trait from my warrior tanking days which I've carried across to the pali, still works for me though.

Something else I've picked up since playing the pali is not to rely on healers to remove debuffs - you can remove most yourself so you might aswell save the healer a job.

Don't be afraid to bubble either - if you have a shit load of dots / debuffs on you which the healers are struggling to keep you up through and the bubble can clear them use it. Just clear the bubble ASAP and grab what ever you were tanking back.

Can't give any words of wisdom on rotations etc.. i tend to go for a priority system of blow whatever is up.

One final piece of advice is dont get demoralized. If things go bad its normally a tank that gets the blame. Be confident and don't take any shit from the rest of the group.

Welcome to the world of the meat shield :D
 

Huung

Well-Known Member
Be aggressive, pull all, dont stop and drag the rest of the group with you... not much else to it really.

Having healed this man in heroics he speaks the truth - he really does do this :p

From what I understand from Sabot, the rotation seems to be a juggle of your 6 second CDs and your 9 second CDs; in such an order that you're popping 6,9,6,9 etc so everything stays up and you don't get things coming off of CD at the same time.

I'm sure an actual pally tank will come and correct me and shoo me away soon enough :D
 

Burrick

Member
Many thanks for all your advice guys it has all been very helpful :)
Today i have been attempting to tank some heroics and dont think i have done too bad for a first timer.. time will tell lol...

i would like to try some raids as a tank too.. maybe starting with naxx 10 or something so if anyone is willing to come along with me that would be great :)

My aim is to get as well geared as my healie spec so i can swap out to either spec whenever i need to and to get some experiance in raids from both sides (and NO gid i dont mean both sides as in man on man action!) filthy perv and 14-2 btw :)
 

Chassandra

In Cryo Sleep
The tanking part of pally tanking is so easy that it's boring. Just pop the 69 whenever possible... it gets mind-numbing after a while.
The main thing is spartial awareness. Keep more focus on what's happending around you than on the rotations (as they aren't a problem anyway). Keep your eyes on the pats/adds/other tanks instead. Keep Sacred Shield up on all the tanks, Hand of Sacrifice when you're offtanking etc etc.
Do take the Hand of Salvation glyph, 20% damage reduction is another life-saving CD and who cares about 10% threat?
Oh, and bubble is a wonderful tool for clearing unwanted debuffs.

When it comes to gear it's really easy. Dodge and stamina are the most important, followed by parry and expertise. You remember shield block? Forget it, it's currently useless compared to dodge/parry. (I don't need to mention def rating, do I?)
 

SgtFury

Junior Administrator
Staff member
Can't agree with Lawn anymore!

A general tip for tanking though is to try and keep your situational awareness up. You never know when someone will randomly pull another pack, off tank dies suddenly, healers are getting mauled... so be on the ball and ready to save the day. You'd be surprised what you can live through as a pali tank with CD's up.

Yes! Yes! Yes!

This is what seperates a good tank from a frustrating tank... the keeping aggro bit becomes second nature and it's more about what else is going on.

I've never been a fan of the stam stacking alot of tanks tend to do, I prefer to aim for a mixed balance of def/stam/strength. Think this is a trait from my warrior tanking days which I've carried across to the pali, still works for me though.

Again I agree.... although they are dropping avoidance down in Icecrown, you still need it... don't be a mana sponge! :)

Don't be afraid to bubble either - if you have a shit load of dots / debuffs on you which the healers are struggling to keep you up through and the bubble can clear them use it. Just clear the bubble ASAP and grab what ever you were tanking back.
Great on Northrend Beasts for the Impale......

One final piece of advice is dont get demoralized. If things go bad its normally a tank that gets the blame. Be confident and don't take any shit from the rest of the group.

After tanking Mechanar over and over as Druid when bleeds didn't effect Mechanicals and a over zealous shadow priest (Yes you Haven!) getting aggro it can get a wee bit demoralizing. But there's nothing like holding the line as tank.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXnXC_75SHI&feature=player_embedded
 

T-Bone

In Cryo Sleep
When it comes to gear it's really easy. Dodge and stamina are the most important, followed by parry and expertise. You remember shield block? Forget it, it's currently useless compared to dodge/parry. (I don't need to mention def rating, do I?)

Tuldur Disagrees. Truth is that is exactly the opposite way of how it should be. Shield Block should NEVER be disregarded although at end game stuff it does mean you take more damage than parry and and dodge, and thus is more difficult to get but if you find some good gear with lots of it on (For example the conquest legs) then you take them and you take them hard. After that Expertise is important once you have enough avoidance. When you have 60% combined avoidance, from block, dodge and parry, reaching the expertise cap is just as important as reaching the defence cap. We get a nice boost to it from the glyph of vengeance glyph and with the odd gem and the odd piece of gear it's easily attainable. Next theres parry. Which is the most important gem to stat for. Most of your gear will exclusively have dodge and the most important thing to do with dodge and parry right now is to try and keep them balanced due to the diminishing returns. You don't want to stop dodging half way into general vezax do you? Stamina is obviously important but gemming/gearing for avoidance is always more important as the stamina will come with the gear. My favourite gem is the +10 Parry Rating/ +15 Stamina gem, Use that one when everywhere you can.

The tanking part of pally tanking is so easy that it's boring. Just pop the 69 whenever possible... it gets mind-numbing after a while.
The main thing is spatial awareness. Keep more focus on what's happening around you than on the rotations (as they aren't a problem anyway). Keep your eyes on the pats/adds/other tanks instead. Keep Sacred Shield up on all the tanks, Hand of Sacrifice when you're offtanking etc etc.

This is slightly more correct. However, never think that the rotation part of paladin tanking is easy. It's easy to do, but to maximise your potential requires some effort. I have spoken to you about glyphs already so you should know that the glyph of consecration will help your rotation flow better. Basically, as long as you have that down and judgment active with five stacks of vengeance up you can usually sleep but making sure you make use of all your other ability which include holy wrath, hand of reckoning and exorcism. Exorsism followed by hand of Reckoning just as exorcism finished casting is the best way to pull now as the boss will get hit by both at once, giving you a good 5K damage on the boss plus the high threat from HoR. Dont be afraid to use exorcism in a fight either. Most bosses hit very slow and/or run away at some point. Use it then, either right after a hit or when he is away from you (A good example is ignis when crotch potting someone). When fighting undead holy wrath is your single best spell :) Also I should remind you of wings, and to use that at the start of fights for increased threat if your having issues. Always remember sanctuary and your divine protection, which should be macroed to trinkets with on use abilites to increase health or what have you. And like people say bubble is great for removing tricky debuffs like impale from Gormak. A good macro is one that casts it then cancels it followed by you immediately using Hor. Never use this with melee on the boss if there is no offtank though.

Be aggressive, pull all, dont stop and drag the rest of the group with you... not much else to it really.

A general tip for tanking though is to try and keep your situational awareness up. You never know when someone will randomly pull another pack, off tank dies suddenly, healers are getting mauled... so be on the ball and ready to save the day. You'd be surprised what you can live through as a pali tank with CD's up.

I've never been a fan of the stam stacking alot of tanks tend to do, I prefer to aim for a mixed balance of def/stam/strength. Think this is a trait from my warrior tanking days which I've carried across to the pali, still works for me though.

Something else I've picked up since playing the pali is not to rely on healers to remove debuffs - you can remove most yourself so you might as well save the healer a job.

Don't be afraid to bubble either - if you have a shit load of dots / debuffs on you which the healers are struggling to keep you up through and the bubble can clear them use it. Just clear the bubble ASAP and grab what ever you were tanking back.

Can't give any words of wisdom on rotations etc.. i tend to go for a priority system of blow whatever is up.

One final piece of advice is don't get demoralized. If things go bad its normally a tank that gets the blame. Be confident and don't take any shit from the rest of the group.

Welcome to the world of the meat shield :D

Lawn speaks some truths. NEVER be afraid to keep pulling. You've healed me before so you know the drill. NEVER wait for the healer, they should always be ready to follow you now. When I use to be a healer and now that I am a tank I always say it's the healers job to be with the tank so unless the healer asks for a mana break go pull more. Sometimes it's good to pull to much and die to know your limits, just don't do it too much in one go.

Also, what Lawn says about cleansing is very important. No one can do it better than us so always have a cleanse yourself macro or just cleanse with auto self target on is a must. A good example of this is fusion punch on the assembly of Iron. Dont listen to him on gemming though, outdated theory. :P

I have SO much more to say, maybe I should write a novel? But cant be fucked typing it. I'll talk to you on TS Sometime. :)
 

Chassandra

In Cryo Sleep
Erm, there is a slight distinction between optimizing your gear and starting to tank heroics. While I do of course agree on all the high-end gearing pointers, I wouldn't reccommend anyone going for expertise (more than the glyph) before getting even close to 20% dodge and enough health to survive the day-to-day basis.
Once you're clad in purples, it's time to weight out the stats exactly like Tuldur says.

Oh, and... different tanks will give different suggestions ;)
 

Huung

Well-Known Member
Burrick tanked UD10 for us this weekend - so he's now at the "end-game" stage me thinks ;)

/cheer
 

Burrick

Member
thanks marqo thats fine praise indeed coming from your good self :)

Well last night i managed to finsh ulduar as a new found tank and really enjoyed it as well as getting to know the bosses from a tankie view.... had a few hiccups but overall i think i done ok... thanks to all involved from last night as well as friday night... :)
 

midgert

In Cryo Sleep
Tuldur Disagrees. Truth is that is exactly the opposite way of how it should be. Shield Block should NEVER be disregarded although at end game stuff it does mean you take more damage than parry and and dodge, and thus is more difficult to get but if you find some good gear with lots of it on (For example the conquest legs) then you take them and you take them hard. After that Expertise is important once you have enough avoidance. When you have 60% combined avoidance, from block, dodge and parry, reaching the expertise cap is just as important as reaching the defence cap. We get a nice boost to it from the glyph of vengeance glyph and with the odd gem and the odd piece of gear it's easily attainable. Next theres parry. Which is the most important gem to stat for. Most of your gear will exclusively have dodge and the most important thing to do with dodge and parry right now is to try and keep them balanced due to the diminishing returns. You don't want to stop dodging half way into general vezax do you? Stamina is obviously important but gemming/gearing for avoidance is always more important as the stamina will come with the gear. My favourite gem is the +10 Parry Rating/ +15 Stamina gem, Use that one when everywhere you can.



This is slightly more correct. However, never think that the rotation part of paladin tanking is easy. It's easy to do, but to maximise your potential requires some effort. I have spoken to you about glyphs already so you should know that the glyph of consecration will help your rotation flow better. Basically, as long as you have that down and judgment active with five stacks of vengeance up you can usually sleep but making sure you make use of all your other ability which include holy wrath, hand of reckoning and exorcism. Exorsism followed by hand of Reckoning just as exorcism finished casting is the best way to pull now as the boss will get hit by both at once, giving you a good 5K damage on the boss plus the high threat from HoR. Dont be afraid to use exorcism in a fight either. Most bosses hit very slow and/or run away at some point. Use it then, either right after a hit or when he is away from you (A good example is ignis when crotch potting someone). When fighting undead holy wrath is your single best spell :) Also I should remind you of wings, and to use that at the start of fights for increased threat if your having issues. Always remember sanctuary and your divine protection, which should be macroed to trinkets with on use abilites to increase health or what have you. And like people say bubble is great for removing tricky debuffs like impale from Gormak. A good macro is one that casts it then cancels it followed by you immediately using Hor. Never use this with melee on the boss if there is no offtank though.



Lawn speaks some truths. NEVER be afraid to keep pulling. You've healed me before so you know the drill. NEVER wait for the healer, they should always be ready to follow you now. When I use to be a healer and now that I am a tank I always say it's the healers job to be with the tank so unless the healer asks for a mana break go pull more. Sometimes it's good to pull to much and die to know your limits, just don't do it too much in one go.

Also, what Lawn says about cleansing is very important. No one can do it better than us so always have a cleanse yourself macro or just cleanse with auto self target on is a must. A good example of this is fusion punch on the assembly of Iron. Dont listen to him on gemming though, outdated theory. :P

I have SO much more to say, maybe I should write a novel? But cant be fucked typing it. I'll talk to you on TS Sometime. :)

Its like he thinks hes a good tank , burrick ask pathfinder:)
 
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