North Korea announce imminent nuclear test, UN is having none of it.

[Tetsuo_Shima]

Russia in talks to prevent test going ahead.

UN to pressure North Korea over nuclear test

North Korea CANNOT be allowed to carry out a nuclear test, I wasn't even aware their nuclear capabilities had come this far.

 

[PsiSoldier]

Why is the US are allowd to do nuclear testing but NK isn't?

 

[Piacular]

Because America got there first .

 

[Tetsuo_Shima]

Why are adults allowed to handle knives when children arent?

And yes, also because America got there first

 

[Ronin Storm]

Wikipedia have an interesting article on the Nuclear Non Proliferation Treaty that North Korea has pulled out of.

The treaty, according to Wikipedia, is based on three main foundations:

1. Those who have nuclear weapons won't spread them or the technology to make them around.
2. Those who have nuclear weapons should work at dismantling their arsenals.
3. Signatories of the treaty retain the right to use nuclear power for energy purposes.

Apparently, the second foundation has had little or no work from the nuclear powers who have signed the treaty, which in turns leads to disgruntlement with other signatories and is cited as a reason by non-signatories for developing their own nuclear weapons.

One deadly farce.

 

[Tetsuo_Shima]

North Korea claims to have carried out nuclear test in blatant disregard for the UN's requests, America surmises test was tantamount to attack

 

[Ronin Storm]

That headline is a little over strong, Tetsuo.

US White House spokesman Tony Snow said: "We expect the UN Security Council to take immediate actions to respond to this unprovoked act."

The word "attack" doesn't appear to be used in that article.

None-the-less...

"Oh crap," said Piglet. We really don't need more powers with nuclear bombs.

 

[pHatBambi]

Here's another good article from the Times Asian editor.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-2395608,00.html

Just gives a good bit of background information on the subject.

Don't expect to see any fireworks just yet. The general consensus is that South Korea does not want any military action and neither does the US.

It seems that a diplomatic solution is the only positive way of resolving the situation.

Fun, fun, fun.

 

[thatbloke]

All of this seems to be a bit of a catch 22 situation...

• The countries with nukes do not want other countries who do not already have nukes to have nukes.
• The countries with nukes do not seem to be very proactive in disarming and destroying their nuclear aresnals.
• The countries that do not currently have nukes therefore see no reason why they should NOT have nukes due to the above two reasons.
• Therefore countries that do not have nukes will develop them for "scientific progress" or "nuclear power" or "self defence" or whatever other reason because of reason 3.
• This means that eventually all countries who are able will probably have nukes at some point in the not-too distant future... But I must admit North Korea having them could be a problem.

 

[Haven]

Having nuclear technology is not what concerns me.

The want/need to use them is what worries me most - after all nuclear power will be needed by many states if we are to stave off further global warming whilst maintaining our current energy usage.

However there are far too many states out there right now with very different opinions on the value of human life. "Death to the infidels" and a strong belief in martydom + nuclear bombs is a very very scary combination in todays highly divided religious world views. Fortunately for all its posturing North Korea does not appear to have any suicidal Jihadi views that I am aware of. Iran however ... now there is a scary prospect for nuclear technology.

 

[Tetsuo_Shima]

Ronin, I saw a tabloid newspaper use the word 'attack' earlier on and I, retardedly, chose to use it.

A military attack from America is out of the question because it would result in a significant war. South Korea wouldn't stand for that and I do not think the American public would either

It was always my understanding that North and South Korea were at odds with each other.

 

[Ronin Storm]

Depends whether "being at odds" is enough to send them into a shooting war, doubly so when the north now has demonstrated that it is interested in nuclear weaponry. Here's to hoping that people have more sense than to push this to shooting.

 

[Tetsuo_Shima]

It wasn't so much S. Korea leading an attack I was questioning, but why South Korea would defend North Korea? Unless of course they directly border each other (which I dont think they do, Im sure there is a small piece of China isolating S. Korea) in which case you wouldn't want nukes landing on your doorstep.

 

[Gopha]

No im pretty sure its a clear border between S.Korea and N.Korea with N.korea bordering china to the north. I'd be more worried about terrorist groups "borrowing" nuclear weapons from the N.Koreans

 

[Ronin Storm]

Gopha's right. Korea's a peninsula.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_peninsula

 

[Tetsuo_Shima]

Ah, so it is. In which case, in a war, South Korea would be completely isolated, and might even be used as a point of insertion into N. Korea.

I'd be more worried about terrorist groups "borrowing" nuclear weapons from the N.Koreans

Now that's interesting. Not so much from the point of view of 'borrowing', but from that of 'retailing'. North Korea's economic situation is by no means stable, punting on nuclear weapons and/or parts of could prove to be a profitable venture for them.

 

[DocBot]

It was just one KT. Are they bluffing?

 

[Pestcontrol]

According to Russian intelligence the weapons are extremely bulky. I'm not worried about NK's weapons falling into the wrong hands either. After all that effort they can't allow that to happen. In that sense Pakistan poses a far greater threat. One coup and you're done.

As for NK's willingness to use them, i doubt that is even the point. NK was in a state of MAD already and that hasn't changed. The nuke secures Kim Jong-Il's position. The primary objective of all dictators is to stay in power.

The bomb's yield is reported to be around 20kt, similar to hiroshima. The nuclear test has NOT been confirmed by seismic readings yet.
Edit: I'm reading here there has been an explosion, in the order of .5 - 10kt. It cannot be confirmed that it is nuclear, atmospheric research can confirm that later even for underground tests (some gases will escape), but it is also possible to conduct a test in such a way that it is impossible to tell whether the explosion is nuclear or not. A few thousand tons of convenctional explosives are a lot but not impossible to make.

It wouldn't be the first time NK bluffs.

 

[PsiSoldier]

Just thought you'd all want to see these.

DailyNK
The Daily Item

 

[DocBot]

According to the Swedish Defence Research Agency the 4.0 on the richter scale means it would be a few KT's, max. So around 1 KT - which is rather strange for a nuclear test, unless it's a failed one.